[Computer-go] Zen blunder in long mirror go game

[Eric Baum]

As I understand the rules (correct me if I'm wrong) white has to make 
the last move or give Black 1 prisoner.
So if black continued playing mirror, he could I think force white to 
give him a point, and then I think he would win
by half a point because the komi was 1/2 and the area is symmetric.
So I believe Zen was losing, but I also don't think he could have had 
any idea of that because it comes from metareasoning-- knowing that the 
opponent could mirror to force him to give up half a point eventually. 
If he understood that, he would have understood not to make the blunder 
he did.

On 1/16/12 4:33 PM, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
>
> I think that the main problem was not winning or losing a mirrored 
> game but the blunder in late endgame by playing suicidal move. Perhaps 
> Zen was losing the game, so this was the reason for the blunder. But 
> if Zen was winning, then it was serious bug and it had nothing to do 
> with the mirroring itself.
>
>       ---Jouni
>
> On Jan 17, 2012 2:26 AM, "Aja Huang" <ajahuang at gmail.com 
> <mailto:ajahuang at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     In the last UEC Cup, the Japanese program katsunari played with
>     mirror Go strategy against Zen, Fuego and ManyFaces. katsunari
>     lost all three games.
>
>     http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/result_2nd/Zen-katsunari.sgf.html
>     <http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/%7Eigo/eng/result_2nd/Zen-katsunari.sgf.html>
>     http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/result_2nd/katsunari-Fuego.sgf.html
>     <http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/%7Eigo/eng/result_2nd/katsunari-Fuego.sgf.html>
>     http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/result_2nd/katsunari-TheManyFacesofGo.sgf.html
>     <http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/%7Eigo/eng/result_2nd/katsunari-TheManyFacesofGo.sgf.html>
>
>     Note that Fuego lost the game finally (by filling own territories)
>     because I carelessly set the config with Chinese rules.  Anyway,
>     there should be no problem for current strong Go programs on
>     mirror Go strategy in "EVEN or tournament games".
>
>     Aja
>
>     -----????----- From: Yamato
>     Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 5:16 PM
>     To: computer-go at dvandva.org <mailto:computer-go at dvandva.org>
>     Subject: Re: [Computer-go] Zen blunder in long mirror go game
>
>     (2012/01/17 8:43), Michael Williams wrote:
>
>         If the author looks at it, could you update us?  I'm always
>         curious
>         about how such things happen, especially in a bot as strong as
>         Zen.
>
>
>     Honestly I don't want to spend a lot of time on this type of problem.
>
>     -- 
>     Yamato
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